Ha! I’m good until 2032 so fuck you, Microsoft!
Assuming MS don’t eventually tweak the activation system to kill MAS altogether and deactivate pirated Enterprise/IoT and LTSC/LTSC IoT installs in the process.
They can do that but I’m sure there are workarounds. I just briefly did a google search on ‘Windows activation workarounds’ and I already see some methods and people talking of them.
So again, Microsoft can fuck themselves.
Linux is easier to use than trying to registry hack your way into a local account.
I am a Linux user, I dual boot Kubuntu and Windows.
On Friday I bought a new game on steam, checked on protondb and it is platinum, tried to launch it and it failed. I tried 4 different proton compatability modes and it failed to launch each time. While I am a sysadmin and am well capable of troubleshooting it, I really just wanted to play that game so I rebooted into windows.
If I hadn’t had that other win11 SSD in my machine, I would have had to not play that game because I had no energy to troubleshoot that on a friday night after fighting with linux all day at work.
Tldr: some times Linux is a seemless as Windows, but not always, even when it is supposed to be and is for others. Even if you have that activate windows watermark.
no, im a linux user. if someone doesnt want to dedicate time to adopt and learn, linux isnt “easier”. even if linux was as easy as windows (idk it can even be compared tbh); its different. different requires time and effort, if someone cant do that (for any reason, this isnt a judgement), its not an easy move.
You need to dedicate time to adopt and learn how to get a local account on Windows and clear out the bullshit you don’t want.
I recently switched to Linux. At first I was surprised at how easy it was to set up and get working, then I was annoyed at having to look up how to do every little thing I know how to do on Windows and considered switching back.
Then I booted into Windows and in less than 10 minutes was fed up the whole OS. I realized I had to look up things just as often as I was on Linux, but in Linux it was because I didn’t know where it was, where as on Windows it was actively hidden from me and fighting me every step of the way.
Windows is in no way easier, It’s just the struggle you’ve gotten so used to fighting with every single day that you’ve forgotten it exists.yea and if u think that ‘switch’ is not deidcated time to learn then idek. im not saying windows is easier or its bs its easier to bypass. but each step of window’s bullshit for a used to user is gonna be less effort than a switch. if someone cant do that effort (for any reason), there isnt a way around it
I don’t disagree in general. However, my mom has been running Linux with a Windows XP skin for almost 8 years now without knowing she’s using Linux. Literally just keeps her from running a random .exe and she does everything on a browser anyway.
In my experience, it’s usually power users or basic users with very specific application requirements, who have trouble moving between operating systems. There’s usually a FOSS alternative to those applications, but often requires reworking a workflow or upskilling more than they want to. But they’re still basic users so it’s more a speed bump than a road block.
So yeah, most people can switch to MacOS without an issue, and the vast majority of those can switch to a distro like Fedora or Ubuntu and quickly feel comfortable.
Power users get stuck in this situation where they’ve learned how to do advanced things in Windows, have things tweaked to support more complex and peculiar workflows, but often don’t understand the actual concepts behind them. And even if they do understand the concepts, they still have to learn the alternatives in a new OS, and rebuild their workflows. Now, there’s a lot more ability to learn behind the scenes about the why and how with Linux and BSD, so I’d argue they’d be better off to just suck it up and get started, and they’ll be better off before long.
My wife is not technical and has no interest in adopting and learning anything.
The web works the same way regardless of the OS, and LibreOffice has all the same features as Word that she uses.
The “hard part” is choosing and upgrading hardware, and maybe installation (depending on distribution).
I mention this because I think we should evaluate these differently. With a preloaded desktop/laptop, I’ve had no issues with anyone that actually relates to Linux (except my BIL who was trying to build an arcade stick for gaming).
Explaining to my other BIL how to select hardware for his custom build, that took some time, as did guiding him through the installation.
im sorry but LibreOffice might have all the features of word but it certainly has a really bad user experience. i write often and libreoffice writer is difficult to say the least, not because of lack of features but a lack of most ‘little things’ and ‘tweaks’. i can definitely see someone switching to libreoffice from word, but saying its not ‘hard’ is untrue or a biased take in my opinion and using both suites (more familiar with libre though lmao).
i do agree that for a mostly web based user as is commonplace nowadays, a preloaded linux thats been decently built is gonna be a significantly easy switch.
on a slight tangent, but linux for me was a way to rebuild my love for computers after windows systematically fucked things. and i really enjoy the learning process. so personally i still encourage people to spend the time in the learning process atleast a bit
i write often and libreoffice writer is difficult to say the least, not because of lack of features but a lack of most ‘little things’ and ‘tweaks’.
I think you’re missing the fact that you are doing more ‘expert’ things than most here. The majority of the time, my wife opens a document she made once, saves as a new file (no, she’s not using templates - don’t get me started), and writes her invoice. She then PDFs it and sends it via email.
She does the same thing with Calc and a previously made blank “monthly calendar”. Opens the blank, saves for the client, enters in the days and renames the month at the top, notes what she’ll be doing for them on each day with an hour estimate, PDF and email.
That is the kind of thing most people do.
ah fuck, i did this
I was seriously considering posting it but didn’t want you to think I was being a dick about it 😀
appreciated, reality checks are best served plain
I think ‘writing stuff in a word processor’ is something every high school kid did, even if it’s generally web based nowadays.
In fact, everyone in this thread has done basically that.
Yeah, LibreOffice stuck with the old UI/UX for better and worse. Luckily we do have a nice selection of Office Suites in addition to them. OnlyOffice, WPS Office, Collabora, KDE Calligra, Softmaker Office… surely there’s one for everyone on Linux.
Personally I like OnlyOffice.
Seconded for ONLYOFFICE. And, yes, they type it in all caps.
I would say give onlyoffice a try. It’s not FOSS but does have free tier for home use and it’s what I go to for non-main work computer. Beats libre imo.
i do use onlyoffice when i have to work with MSOffice docs, its very similar. but the emphasis on AI has irked me too much to make it a regular use
Well, the whole reason people have to “adopt and learn” is because M$ bought their way onto virtually every new PC sold back in the 90s, so people’s first experience would be their “operating system.”
Talk about leveraging anchoring bias.
I’d argue you’d have a hard time selling Windows to people if you were honest about it.For just 145€ you get:
- an operating system that assumes you’re an inept idiot
- ads in your application launcher
- a screenshot taken every minute, which gets stored outside your control and analysed by “AI”
- an invasive “assistant” that listens in on your microphone at all times
- forced to create an account to log in to “your” machine, so we can collect even more personal data
Especially when the alternative is free and let’s you do whatever you want with your hardware. And if you happen to misconfigure something you get to be an adult about it and learn from your mistakes.
and i also say this as someone who is required to use windows at work. i despise windows, its so much harder for me to use windows given linux been my daily driver for a long time. im annoyed at powershell, explorer, clunky shortcut behaviors, etc just about every second im on windows. its a nightmare difficulty for me, but i also refuse to ever relearn windows stuff. i do remember a time when it wasnt annoying as fuck to use, could be nostalgia or that people just adopt.
using windows as a linux user is a nightmare. but if someone is adopted to windows, the opposite is gonna be similar no matter what.
I also use windows for work. Shits stupid. Search in the start bar for an app that’s installed on your PC? Let’s open edge and show you web results. Want to copy something out of teams? Here’s a copilot link you just accidentally clicked. Thanks for accepting that TOS.
I’d love some say on my work computer but alas I’m a grunt.
The administration tools are just as bad.
I want to add a user to a group, so I bring up Entra and search Groups, too bad it’s a Mail-enabled Security group, so now I have to do it in Exchange admin and enable a separate admin role for myself.
I want to disable a device in Intune, so I search for device XYZ in Intune and there’s no disable button. You have to figure out who’s the primary user on the device, look them up, find XYZ in their device assignments and there’s the disable button.
Sure you can do it in Powershell or Graph and hope they haven’t deprecated whatever module you were using last week or changed the process entirely.
Don’t get me started with administrating access on folders in Teams and Sharepoint somehow not give a fuck about it.
Bazzite, legit unless you got some funky setup you just install and go.
I don’t think you realize just how complicated it has become to administer windows these days.
as stated in the thread, i use windows at work
Agree, but Linux (and Mac) both fall to the sunk time fallacy. “I’ve spent years learning to navigate around Windows’s bullshit, so doing the same with a new OS is time I’d rather spend just using my OS!” It’s bullshit and should be called out as such.
All three of the major OSes are piss easy to use. Linux, specifically if you’re using Mint or Ubuntu and it’s already set up. Some Linux distros (e.g. Arch) take some effort to set up, but you’re rewarded for doing so by knowing more about how your computer works.
And they all have advantages. Windows is used by more people and more programs are made for it. It also has some of the best compatibility. Mac is the best “commercial” OS. It’s made for humans, it’s UNIX certified (though that certification is like 40 years old or something), it’s not made by Microsoft, and it’s used by creatives. Linux is aimed more at coders and tinkerers and people who want to really own their computer and control it at a deeper level. All of them can serve a person’s needs well and they all run Firefox.
I have used all of them forever and it is no longer true that Windows and mac os are easy. Easy if you pay, maybe? If you don’t want to use certain things and want to give all data? Its a nightmare if you have a hobby or show or thing you like to do on a computer
Nah, these “hacks” are very easy. Easier than installing and learning even the most basic of Linux distros.
Tell me you haven’t even tried
…?
Without telling me you haven’t tried
Haven’t tried what…?
You haven’t installed and learned the most basic Linux system
I’ve been using Ubuntu on multiple PCs for years. If you think installing and learning a beginner-friendly distro is quicker or easier than running a massgrave script then you are genuinely clueless.
It’s true. You run one single command in cmd, then follow the prompts. It literally highlights what you probably want too, nevermind the guide online. Even Linux mint you still have to learn where stuff is and what it’s called. That’s not hard, by any means, but this is literally a single command and then you’re back to your routine.
Hahaha a script to amend an installation for now is so much faster than … OOPS my dist installed in 23 sec and has privacy features and zero bloat or ads from the get go
not really
Can confirm. Just switched to Linux about 2 weeks ago. I am happy enough, but there was a brutal learning curve. This was for a distro that is user friendly, too. I was able to install just fine, but actually getting my environment set up is an ongoing process.
Many Linux distros are getting there, but they still aren’t ready for casual users.
I’ve been using Linux for 20 years. The learning curve is still too steep for me.
Wouldn’t you have the same experience if you moved from iOS to Android, never having used Android before? Does that make Android not ready for casual use?
If you have used Windows your whole life, there will definitely be a learning curve getting used to Linux and whatever desktop environment you choose to use.
I personally have better experience having casual users use Linux than Windows.
There is a difference between going from a GUI based OS to a hybrid GUI/console OS.
For both iOS and Android the only difference is where things live. The processes are still the same.
This is not the case with Windows and Linux. If you want to install something in Windows you go to a website and download an installer. For Linux, you find out if there is a package. If not you go to a website and see if there is an app image or zip file. You then need to know where to place the downloaded file, how to get it running (making it executable), knowing how to chmod and chown (it is better to have to do it like in Linux, but it is an extra step), and how to add it to your desktop (there is no right+click and add to desktop/create shortcut option in Arch based distros like there is on Windows). If there is a service component you may need to go into command line and systemctl to enable it.
Your comparison to iOS and Android is not really appropriate.
For Linux, you find out if there is a package. If not you go to a website and see if there is an app image or zip file. You then need to know where to place the downloaded file, how to get it running (making it executable), knowing how to chmod and chown (it is better to have to do it like in Linux, but it is an extra step), and how to add it to your desktop (there is no right+click and add to desktop/create shortcut option in Arch based distros like there is on Windows). If there is a service component you may need to go into command line and systemctl to enable it.
I don’t think I’ve ever followed that workflow to be honest. Except for when doing something niche and way above and beyond something a casual user would do.
Open the software center, search what you want. Click install. Done. I use the terminal to the same effect but that’s by preference. Installing packages as you described is not at all recommended… They won’t update with the system.
The “add to desktop” thing really depends on your Desktop Environment too. GNOME not really, KDE and most others yeah.
In fact, one has a similar learning curve going from Android to iOS (as I learned when I transitioned to iPhone) even if iOS is broadly considered more “user friendly.”
I think you’re onto something. Switching to Windows would be painful to anyone used to Linux regardless of all the philosophical differences simply because the OS works differently. Lord knows I despise MacOS despite people who use it saying, “it just works.”
I was only using “from iOS to Android” as an example. I believe it would be equally difficult going from Android to iOS. As you, I also despise using MacOS. It’s a struggle, because I’m not used to it in any way.
get excited for a random system update to boot you to a GRUB rescue console soon!
When was the last time you used Linux? And what distro was it? Your complaints are a decade out of date.
this exact situation happened about 3 months ago to my partner on a modern distro
You should give the name of the distro rather than just say modern. Ubuntu is “modern” and they broke the auto-updates for everyone some months ago. It’s more about stability than modernity
oh, so when the Linux fanboys come out and say “you should switch to Linux, it’s easy!” they actually mean learn the decades long history of countless distributions, fork infighting, and an untold amount of software and hardware compatibility baggage, THEN switching will be easy! silly of me to make such a mistake!
I’m curious what setup you have to do?
I do some customization of KDE on my desktop, but for my laptops it’s always install and use without the need to setup anything.Which distros are you using on laptop? I have a gaming laptop, I’ve been procrastinating on the switch because I dont want to lose some things. I really enjoy the control software for the lights and fans that it came pre-installed with, for example
If anything, Linux gives you far more control over those things and it’s usually much easier to do than in Windows.
I’ve been using Bazzite for gaming for over a year now and it’s great. It is immutable though, so while you can do just about anything you can do in other distros, the process can be different.
I’ve seen a lot of people suggesting CachyOS lately for gaming, if you want something that isn’t immutable.
yep, I have used many linux distros for 20 years or so, and they are certainly much harder to migrate to than checks notes pressing two keys and running a command to get a local account.
good luck getting more than a few hours into a fresh linux install without needing to use a CLI, lol
Why is it acceptable to use command line to setup Windows, but not Linux?
Bottom line is, if you’re not willing to put the minimal effort in, then you shouldn’t ever complain about Windows being shit.
you seem to have misinterpreted or misread this comment thread, sorry.
No, seems pretty clear to me.
and they are certainly much harder to migrate to than checks notes pressing two keys and running a command to get a local account.
Then literally immediately, in the same comment:
Good luck getting more than a few hours into a fresh linux install without needing to use a CLI, lol
Good luck installing your pirated Windows without needing to use the CLI, lol.
quoting me and saying “don’t you see?” is not exactly demonstrating reading comprehension.
if you want to go on a crusade against CLIs, feel free, but leave me out. i think they’re great.
the comparison i replied to was whether it was easier to migrate to Linux vs setting up a local account, and any user is going to spend much more time migrating than running a single command.
How do you run that command you mentioned? Was it a few hours in or right at installation and login?
good luck getting more than a few hours into a fresh linux install without needing to use a CLI, lol
I use the terminal on my dev machine, but that’s because of what I do. Never opened the terminal on my laptops.
yet you claim windows you need to also…checks notes run commands in cli
sure, because the comment i was replying to talked about local accounts, and that’s how you do that on some editions of Windows 11.
ok… but youre claiming that jumping through hoops to get Linux to work is bad, yet it’s ok on windows? makes no sense.
I’d personally rather have full control of my PC rather then some company telling me how to use my computer.
From the devs Github
KMS38 has now been removed from the MAS script. Users are advised to use HWID or TSforge activation instead.
So you can still activate Windows through the other means in the script already. I dunno the ins n’ outs, of what makes one method better than another. When I checked it seemed HWID was the first option and the one most people use anyway sooooo…
Here are the differences between the methods: https://massgrave.dev/chart
Cloudflare error is my favorite activation method.
You’re right, but still. Reduction of options is never good for the community.
I am waiting for SteamOS Desktop to be released before abandoning Windows. Way I figure, that is the best way to get a ‘casual’ Linux, without scrimping on utility. Having Valve as the distro provider would also ensure that my flavor of Linux is stable, well supported, and documented.
Windows has become too shitty to pay for. And now they do this.
Always has been.
deleted by creator
Thanks
One more reason never to install windows.
What is Windows?
Those things that let light in your home, car, bus, train ,etc
Wait there is something behind the curtain?
Instead of FIXING the problem.
Don’t think this has anything to do with extended service update activation if you are concerned about that. The ESU should still work as it uses a different activation approach. Massgrave also has other ways to activate windows.
And Microsoft might actually have broken this by accident. If they wanted to get rid of massgrave they would probably start by deleting the github org.
o7
Hopefully they don’t brick my functionality.
they are just bricking their own functionality is all.
I use LTSC IoT for my consulting laptop. If Win were released this way normally, there wouldn’t be as many haters.
I still prefer my Årch box, this version of Windows is totally acceptable to me.
If Win were released this way normally, there wouldn’t be as many haters.
- It used to be until Win8.x. Win7 was the last release where the only bloat you had to deal with was third-party bloat on a shitty OEM prebuilt you got at your local big-box store. A clean install from a vanilla MS install media was just that; a clean install. -sigh- You know Windows is toast when you’re nostalgic for the days where the extent of your bloatware woes were Norton or McAfee, or whatever OEM bloat came on your system that a clean install with a vanilla media would easily get rid of.
