• ZombiFrancis@sh.itjust.works
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    9 months ago

    I like any political map that triangulates liberals from the left and right.

    And I love any one that properly omits libertarians.

    • Uiop@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      9 months ago

      I am getting more and more confused.

      Liberty ≈ Freedom.

      Liberal is someone beliveing in something adjacent to freedom. Libertarian is someone believing in something adjecent to freedom.

      But I only hear bad things about liberals, alright I already knew 'Merricans are stupid, they get angry about a word while not even being autistic. But I also somethymes hear about libertarians. what the fuck is that supposed to be, especially compared to its namely cousin?

      Well I know I’m not being entirely fair to the poor, old 'Murricans, there surely is something they all know about their system, that has not yet reached me. Still calling someone by one of your core tenets ('Murrica, land of the free, home to lady liberty…) and believing that to be an unterstandible slur sure is weird.

      • Dr. Bluefall@toast.ooo
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        9 months ago

        Libertarian has two different meanings, depending on who you talk two.

        In the modern day, and unless they qualify it, “libertarianism = anarcho-capitalism”.

        Classical libertarianism (sometimes left libertarianism, or libertarian socialism) is more akin to anarcho-syndicalism. Advocacy for ownership of the means of production via trade unions and the like, with the goal of obsoleting the state and capitalism, that kinda thing.

        EDIT: Also, capital-L “Liberalism” in the US is more than a little bit of a departure from liberalism. It’s mostly evolved into a meaningless pejorative the far right uses against the center-left (and when I say that, I’m talking about center-left from an American perspective, so really more center-right)

    • bdonvr@thelemmy.club
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      9 months ago

      Most leftists, generally yes.

      Doesn’t mean they like US style gun culture or obsessed with them. But the system leftists oppose is armed and has/will use those arms upon leftists that gain any significant amount of power.

      Arm the oppressed.

    • MudMan@fedia.io
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      9 months ago

      Honestly, the “likes guns” part doesn’t work anywhere outside the US, if that. And that includes conservatives.

      Internationally I’m pretty sure “hates Trump” would absolutely be in the center, too.

      • Tinidril@midwest.social
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        9 months ago

        “Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary” - Karl Marx

        • yetAnotherUser@discuss.tchncs.de
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          9 months ago

          This quote applies to Marx’s time though. When armed workers would have had nearly the same arsenal as a professional military. When horse carriages and trains were the only way to move soldiers at all.

          In the age of tanks, jets and missiles, do you seriously believe workers have the slightest chance against a military? It takes a single nuke to crush a revolution that is not supported by the military.

          • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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            9 months ago

            Leftists maintain that Revolution is necessary, and the past century has shown countless guerilla victories over Imperialists with better technology using asymetrical warfare tactics. War is evolving.